Connections That Stick: Turning Relationships into Lasting Opportunities

Alana Muller:
Welcome to Enterprise.ing, a podcast from Enterprise Bank & Trust, that's empowering business leaders one conversation at a time. Each week we'll hear from top business professionals about lessons on leadership and entrepreneurship that they've learned along the way. I'm your host, Alana Muller, an entrepreneurial executive leader whose primary focus is to connect, inspire, and empower community. We at Enterprise Bank & Trust thank you for tuning into another episode.

Hello listeners, welcome back to Enterprise.ing podcast. Anne Laguzza is with us today. She's president and CEO of The Works Consulting, where she is a leadership development coach and HR consultant all rolled into one. I hope you'll join me in welcoming her to the Enterprise.ing studio today. Anne Laguzza, welcome.

Anne Laguzza:
Thank you. I'm so looking forward to this conversation.

Alana Muller:
Well, I'm so happy to have you here and I want to jump right in. I know that you believe that every leader has the right tools to build and manage a successful team. Talk about that. What are those tools and how has your perspective on leadership motivated you to create The Works Consulting?

Anne Laguzza:
Well, I talk a lot about leaders being able to lead, listen to and love their people, and I really think that's one of the best frameworks for how leaders can lead, right? Because there are obviously things that fall under the lead category, the listening to your people, and then what I kind of love about the, “Love your people part,” is it's not always, because a lot of times in HR people think, "Oh, it's all about the fluffy stuff," but it's also about making those tough decisions. When it's time for a team member to move on, or maybe have a tough conversation because a team member isn't meeting expectations.

So I really do… I think in all the years I've been doing this, I know that if you really want to be a leader, you can make it happen. For some people, it might take a little more effort than others. Because I will say that I've met leaders that are good, natural — they have a good sense of how to be a good leader, but you can do it. That's what I love, is it's absolutely something that's coachable, learnable, if you will, and they can do that.

So how I got started is, I really was more focused on the human resources side when I first started my business. I'm located in California, and although now we have clients everywhere, at that time, I was really focused here in California. But as time went on, like within maybe three to five years of my business, I thought, "You know what? Compliance isn't really the problem." That's actually easy to learn. I mean, it really is. What the challenge that I'm finding is that leaders are just not getting the training they need and the coaching they need, and they don't know how to do some of the things they had hoped they would be able to do when they got promoted.

Alana Muller:
Yeah. Are you seeing that, is it an age thing, is it a business maturity, is it length of years in business…what do you think are some of the obstacles that they've faced to get those or to realize that they had the tools?

Anne Laguzza:
That is such a good question. I don't think anyone's ever asked me that. And I'm going to tell you that one of the leaders I work with right now, she is a brand new leader. I don't know exactly what her age is, but I would say she's newer into the work world and she just has a fantastic sense about the way to treat people, and that has just helped her tremendously. So, I think that what really helps people, I do think you have to want to be a leader. And I think sometimes what happens unfortunately, is people accept leadership roles because there's a financial incentive. And I understand it, I'm not judging, right? I understand completely.

But it's like, "Oh, that'd be great. I want to make more money," without realizing like, "But do I want what comes along with this?" And there's a lot of responsibility. I don't even think a lot of companies talk about it in preparation for someone getting promoted. And then I think unfortunately, because quite often people are promoted because they're really good at their job, there's not a whole lot of investment made now that you're not the employee doing the… I mean, you're still going to have work obviously, but doing that day-to-day, now you're going to have one or more employees reporting to you, what does that look like and how do we help you be successful at that?

Alana Muller:
Yeah, it makes so much sense. It reminds me, early in my career, I was with a couple different corporate organizations and I think I took for granted the fact that because they were huge corporate entities, they really provided such fabulous professional development opportunities. And thankfully, I took advantage of some of those. But now, gosh, looking back, I wish I would have done even more, right?

Anne Laguzza:
I totally agree.

Alana Muller:
Nobody tells you you're going to need these things.

Anne Laguzza:
Pay attention, it's going to be helpful down the road.

Alana Muller:
Yeah.

Anne Laguzza:
I know. And I think you just said something so valuable, and even I think sometimes... One of my clients did this, they brought us in to do a leadership development series. But not only did they open it up to the current leadership, they said, "Hey, if anyone's interested in leadership, or if you just want to learn more, join in." And so it was like we're also talking to people who may in the future be a leader in your organization, so that they can start to understand what that involves. Because there's really nothing bad about learning the skills that you're going to need. It's all about communication, and I was going to say like being a role model, yeah all those things.

Alana Muller:
Well, and we need those things. “Leader” is generic, right? We don't have to be managers to be leaders. And so what you're describing is, how nice that company is welcoming in all of its employees, all of its people, to gain from that opportunity. So, that's fabulous. And it leads me to ask you…so, I love the name of your company, The Works Consulting, where did the name come from and how does it hint at what you do? I mean, you kind of described it, but where'd “The Works” come from? Anne Laguzza: Well, thank you for asking. When I started my career — and I think this still is pretty true today — I mean, people were traditionally human resources professionals or they were leading “training and development,” as still some companies call it. My career, I was really lucky. My very first human resources job, I started as a manager and they not only… I was… my second job out of college, they gave me the human resources side, but they also let me do training.

And I learned how to facilitate workshops, basically, is how we would say it today, and teach people how to, we did all different kinds of things there. We did skills training and some leadership training, etc. And so when I started my company, I was really like, just like when you order a burger, a hamburger and you get the works on it, it was that idea. It's like you don't just come here for HR and you don't have to just come here for training or just come here for coaching. We do it all for you. Because that's really my training and background, and now I've obviously given that training to my team so that they can also assist me in providing that.

Alana Muller:
Terrific. Terrific. Well, my personal area of interest and focus is really on relationship building, and so I'd love to ask you about your experience with relationship building. What role do relationships play in your work and how do you leverage your connections to enhance your own success and the success of your clients?

Anne Laguzza:
So, one of the things about our business that sometimes is surprising to folks is that we're almost 99% referral. I've been in business now 24 years this year, and we have 100% built this business on referrals. Am I on social media? Of course I am, because everybody should be out there. But do I generate a ton of leads from posts that I put or reels or whatever? No. Typically, we get referrals from other people referring us, and from our clients coming back. And so I think that aspect of building relationships has just been so important that I kind of joke, I mean, I don't know if it's really a joke, but you know how they say, is it six degrees from Kevin Bacon or something like that?

Alana Muller:
Oh, yeah, exactly. Yes.

Anne Laguzza:
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, you never know how far you are away from the next person you want to meet. And I always think about that, because I think sometimes people are short-sighted, right? They go to an event or they go to a networking meeting and they're like, "Oh, I thought there'd be other people here that I can meet." And it's like, you just never know who is going to know someone or that will introduce you to the next person that gets you a little closer to where you're trying to go. And I think that's really been a big foundation for me is, treat people like you're going to see them every single day.

Because if you treat them and make them feel good, they'll remember that. And I mean that in the most genuine way. I don't mean that at all in any kind of, I don't want anybody to be fake, I want it to be a genuine way. But you really treat people like, "Hey, I am likely going to see this person again. I want to be memorable, I want to be helpful and I want to build that kind of connection."

Alana Muller:
Oh, I love it. I might just steal that from you. That's excellent. Just, I love it. That idea that it's not just, “Treat others as you wish to be treated,” but treat them like you're going to be having dinner with them every day for the next 50 years. I don't know, that you don't want to burn bridges, I think that's what you're describing.

Anne Laguzza:
You don't. Somebody told me once, it was a vendor actually I'd been working with, and one of my clients at that time, this was years ago, had decided that they were going to move on and hire someone else. And I was so devastated and I called her because she knew this, the client. And she said, "You know what, Anne? You just, with such graciousness, you say, 'Thank you so much. I wish you the best. Let me know if you need anything else.'" Because she said, "You just never know."

And it was so interesting because it was with… it took about a year, but they did come back and they were like, "We really weren't very happy and we thought “the grass was greener” moment and we're going to come back and we want to work with you again." And I thought, "Oh my gosh, thank goodness she said that." Because I think that that was very early on in my business, and I just think I wouldn't have realized that you never know. You just never know what's going to happen. Alana Muller: Well, and imagine, had you kicked them to the curb, so to speak, or had that bridge been burned, you never would have known that first departure really had nothing to do with you.

Anne Laguzza:
Absolutely.

Alana Muller:
And that you were actually providing exactly what they needed, so that's a great story. Great story. Well, and it kind of leads me to my next question. I know that professional challenges are at the heart of the work that you do with your clients, so thinking about your own experiences, what are some of the obstacles that you have faced in your business and how are you able to overcome them to emerge as a stronger leader?

Anne Laguzza:
I have been particularly faced with, I would say, three significant challenges in my business. One is, I was in business in 2007 or '08 when the economy took a big turn. I was in business in 2020 when we were all faced with huge challenges.

Alana Muller:
Yep.

Anne Laguzza:
And I think the one that often really stands out to me is that there was a time in my business where I had a really great client, they wanted a lot of my time, and so I probably gave them about 80% of my time. So that means I really only have 20% of my income coming from other sources. And I got very casual in my billing because they'd always paid me on time, so I wasn't really following up on the invoices as well. And they pulled me into an office one day and said, "You know what? We are going through tremendous financial difficulties and we're going to have to cancel your contract today."

Alana Muller:
Oh my goodness.

Anne Laguzza:
So that alone, right? I was like, "What?" And then they said, "And worse news, we can't make good on any of your invoices at this time." And I'm like, "Oh my gosh." That had to be one of the worst times I've ever been through in my business. It still gives me the chills and anxiety. And I remember going home and kind of, I had a home office, sitting at my desk and just, "What am I going to do? 20% of my business is great, I love those folks, but I don't have enough to continue." So, I reached out to someone who I knew very well who worked at this company who had a lot of leverage, and I shared with them what was going on and they said, "I'm going to make sure you get paid."

Alana Muller:
Wow.

Anne Laguzza:
And he actually said, "I will personally pay you myself if it comes down to that, but I'm going to make sure you get paid." So again, it kind of goes back to that connection, that relationship. He did say, "I'm so sorry that's how it was communicated to you. Obviously, I wasn't part of the decision-making process." And so I just really worked with him during that time and he was able to get me completely paid. But during that time, right, I'm sitting there and I'm thinking, I remember getting up the next day and kind of like, "Okay, what do I do?"

And I just started reaching out to people I'd worked with in the past and people I knew and just, "Do you know anyone who's possibly needing a consultant?" And I remember a really good friend of mine, we had only met, I had actually taken over some workshops that he was facilitating for another company and he had moved on, so I took those over for him. I reached out to him and he said, "Oh, hey, guess what?" He was teaching at Cal State Dominguez Hills, which is a university out here, and he said, "We actually need a new facilitator, a new instructor. It's at night, so you'll be able to do your business during the day." And what I loved, because he didn't know what was going on, I mean I didn't give him the details, but he's like, "You know, it doesn't pay much, but it's a nice little extra income." And I'm thinking, "I don't care what it pays, right? Like I just need income right now."

Alana Muller:
Anything would be good right now, right?

Anne Laguzza:
I know. And I was like, "Wow." This all came out of me taking over a workshop that he'd been facilitating, us spending two or three days together in that transition and really building a bond. And then there he is saying, "Oh my gosh, guess what I have?" He got me right in, like the interview process was easy, and I did that for seven years.

Alana Muller:
Wow.

Anne Laguzza:
And I taught for seven years and I really enjoyed it and I was forever grateful. I think that connection… again, it goes back to what we were just talking about, but I just think you just never know and you just got to keep those connections. And I think you kind of alluded to this or said it. One of the things I think people, the mistake they make, is they reach out to connections and ask them for something where I think you always have to be thinking about, “what can I do for this person? What's the value I can bring,” right?

Alana Muller:
Yeah.

Anne Laguzza:
Yeah, “how can I help them so that…,” you know? And not like, "Oh, if I help you, you'll help me." Also, I think you need to stay away from that. I think you just need to lead from the place of, "I want to be helpful to people because that's the energy I want to put out there." And then ultimately, I really believe it always comes back. Alana Muller: For sure. Well, and gosh, you shared so many lessons in that one story. I mean, first of all, we need to stay up on our billing, right? Especially small businesses.

Anne Laguzza:
I know, you're right.

Alana Muller:
And as close as you feel to your clients, just to be mindful that there is a transactional business-related aspect that we have to be mindful of, especially small business owners. The second thing though is the fact that you were able to reach out to that connection and that he made good on the promise on behalf of his company, is impressive. And so in one regard, the fact that you were able to ask for help, you knew that you needed help, and that you knew who to ask. And that he was receptive to it, I think, is impressive on both parts. And then this idea of maintaining those connections, I just think that there's no replacement for that, so bravo to you.

Anne Laguzza:
It's so important.

Alana Muller:
Fabulous.

Anne Laguzza:
It's so interesting, I have to share this with you because that same person... so literally, so I met him in… 24 years. So that was, let's just say like 21, 22 years ago. He just reached out to me last year. Obviously, he's at a new company, he's been at many new companies, but they needed some support, they were going through certain transitions in their HR department and he reached out to me and said, "I want to introduce you to the CEO because I think you'd be great." And I'm thinking, "We haven't worked together in forever." But it goes back to that connection, right? That… I do post a lot on LinkedIn and he sees those posts and he's like, "I've been keeping up with you even though you might not be able to tell." And then we were able to work with his new company and we were able to do some amazing work for them, and it was such a pleasure to really have him come back again.

Alana Muller:
Love it. That's so nice. That's such a, it's just a great story and again, great lessons learned, so I appreciate you sharing that. What's something you're working on now that you're especially excited about?

Anne Laguzza:
Oh my gosh. Well, I'll tell you. I mean, it's not necessarily new per se, but I have to share with you, because it is something I'm so passionate about. A few years ago, actually right around 2021, I guess, it would seem to be the good time to start it, but I started a program called Mentohrship. And it's actually M-E-N-T-O-H-R-SHIP. And it's a program, it's all web-based, so it can be anyone from anywhere. My whole focus is to help HR professionals have the career that they desire. HR is frequently undervalued, people are always talking about, "I want a seat at the table."

And I remember asking someone one time, "What table did you want to sit at?" And they don't even know, but they know they're supposed to say that. I think that HR professionals, I think it's getting better. I think every year that I've been in this industry, I do think there, it's coming up and there are a lot more employers that value them, but I know many because I talk to them all the time.

I created this program to bring them together in a small group format for them really to start building a community, but also I teach them things about really just how to demonstrate their value, and how to be that sort of HR person that they're desiring to be. So, we don't so much focus on the compliance piece, we really focus on how to be a great HR leader. And I love it. I love the people in it, I love seeing the connections that they make with each other, I love when they have those light bulb moments like, "Oh, I thought I was the only one that was experiencing this, but there's five or six other people in this group that are having similar challenges," and I just absolutely love it.

Alana Muller:
So great. So great. Well, so tell me this, do you have a mentor, speaking of mentorship?

Anne Laguzza:
I do.

Alana Muller:
Is there a mentor or somebody in your life? Who's that? Talk about the impact they've had on your life.

Anne Laguzza:
I feel lucky that I have a few. I would say that I do have a professional coach. I actually, they have a team concept, so I have a team concept of coaches that all focus on different areas. Like whether it be marketing or mindset or organization and streamlining and processes, and I absolutely love that. And business growth, they're amazing.

And then I just, I have a fantastic friend who, she is a business owner herself and I just love connecting with her and swapping stories, if you will, of challenges and things that are going well and running ideas by her. Because she's just such a level-headed resource and she asks such great questions. I ask people questions all day long, right, and sometimes it's so hard to coach yourself. So I just called her the other day and I had a challenge that came up and she just presents such thoughtful questions to make you really think through what it is you're thinking about doing, why you would think about doing it, why maybe you don't want to do it, and I really appreciate that.

Alana Muller:
Wow, it sounds like she's a great thought partner.

Anne Laguzza:
Yeah.

Alana Muller:
I love the ability to ask good questions and to really get you thinking. And then it's a way that it's kind of a safe environment so you can brainstorm, and so I think that's great. Is there one piece of advice that you've received over the years, whether from her or from anybody, that has just been like, "That thing. That's the best piece of advice I've ever gotten." Anything like that?

Anne Laguzza:
I know, although a couple of things come to mind. I would say one of my favorite conversations was when I was first starting my business. I was really fortunate that I met someone who owned her own business and we became friends. It was really funny, it was the first time I'd ever gone on a trip by myself and I just happened to meet her on this trip with some other folks, and it was great. We formed a friendship, all of us, it was so fun.

But I remember telling her, like I'm obviously questioning her like, "Oh, so tell me about when you started your business." And she's in a totally different area, and so I started kind of, going to what I had learned through my education and what I've read and, "Well, I need a business plan and I need a logo and I need a website and I need this." And she looks at me one day, we were at lunch and she's like, "Anne, do you know what you really need?" And I said, "What?" I'm like, "What do I need?" She's like, "You need customers." And she's like, "Figure out if this concept is even going to generate enough income for you to live and you can go back and do all that stuff."

Alana Muller:
Yeah, you need the money to pay for the logo and the website and the stationery, right?

Anne Laguzza:
She's like, "While I understand you're trying to professionalize and all that." And she's like, "But you could literally get business cards made up anywhere, and it doesn't matter what's written on them as long as they can contact you." But yeah, and I love that she said that. Her name is Danae. I say to business owners or people who tell me they want to start a business all the time, because the idea is the easy part. You might've even heard that. The idea of starting your business, that's the easy part, that's the fun part. And I have seen more new entrepreneurs get stuck in all of the stuff they think they have to create before they can present themselves to the public.

And I always encourage them, "You know what? Get out in front of people as fast as you can," because I'll tell you what, and this is kind of what else she said. She said, "I can almost guarantee you that whatever your business is today is not going to be the same thing, maybe even 12 months from now." So, she's like, "You get out there and start hustling and see if you can get some customers and then we'll work on the rest of it." And she's totally right. I mean, my business has transformed over the years. I mean, I do know you need a business plan, some people really do need one, but I've never looked back at it like, "Oh gosh, it would have been so different if I would've spent hours and days and maybe even months not getting out there." And she's like, "You need to get out there."

Alana Muller:
Love it. I love that advice. Very sound wisdom. I really like it.

Anne Laguzza:
Right?

Alana Muller:
So good. Well, it's been so fun talking with you. As we begin to wrap up, there's a question that I ask of every guest, and I have to ask you, too, and it is this: If you could have a cup of coffee with anybody, it can be fictional, non-fictional, living or not living, who would it be and why?

Anne Laguzza:
Okay. It would be Sara Blakely.

Alana Muller:
Oh, nice.

Anne Laguzza:
So, she is the creator of Spanx, right? And most recently, Sneex. I am truly obsessed. I think that, I know sometimes when we meet our heroes or the people we really want to meet, there sometimes is a difference of what we think it's going to be like, but I truly think she's the person who she portrays herself to be. I feel like she just seems very down to earth, I think she's incredibly smart, and I love the risks that she's taken in the face of a lot of people saying no. When she still forged forward and really made a phenomenal company. Everybody knows Spanx. I think everyone's going to know her Sneex company too, and I would love that. And she happens to like coffee, so that would be perfect. I would love to sit down, have a cup of coffee.

Alana Muller:
That sounds great.

Anne Laguzza:
And just kind of ask her, like, "Looking back now…" I know she shares about a lot of this stuff on social, but just learning what goes on in her head on a daily basis. Is it like a million different ideas? Or does she have one idea and kind of hangs onto it and runs with it until it actually comes out? But I would love that.

Alana Muller:
Great choice. Can I come with you maybe?

Anne Laguzza:
Yes.

Alana Muller:
Or maybe I could sit at the next table and just listen in, how's that?

Anne Laguzza:
Well, if I ever get the opportunity, I'll be like, "I have to bring a friend with me."

Alana Muller:
Yeah, call me.

Anne Laguzza:
Yeah.

Alana Muller:
Well, Anne Laguzza, I have loved our conversation. I love your energy. Where can our listeners go to learn more about you and about The Works Consulting?

Anne Laguzza:
Oh, thank you. Okay, so I do have a website. It's theworksconsulting.com, just like it sounds. I am on Instagram under my name, Anne Laguzza, and I'm also on LinkedIn under Anne Laguzza. And both, all of that's all work related. You'll get some great tips about life and leadership and you'll get to see a little bit of what I'm doing in the world just for fun when I'm out there having a good time, so that would be great to connect.

Alana Muller:
Well, thank you so much. Anne Laguzza, thank you so much for being on Enterprise.ing podcast.

Anne Laguzza:
Thank you.

Alana Muller:
Thanks for joining us this week on Enterprise.ing. Be sure to visit our website, enterprisebank.com/podcast to subscribe so you'll never miss an episode. If you found value in today's program, please consider leaving a review on Apple Podcasts or telling a friend about us. Enterprise.ing, powering business leaders one conversation at a time.

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